Oh come'on Eric! So you're saying that you folks have never upsold anyone on a copier with features they don't need? And you've never sold one of those highly profitable maintenance agreements?

Well, I guess we've eliminated one possible origin of your nickname, BigMo! LOL!

Confucious say, "A copywriter with a conscience is a hungry copywriter."

I don't know about anybody else around here...but when I start doing the DM stuff for gourmet products, I plan on only promoting quality stuff and manipulating the hell out of the reader.

Acutally, we always start with asking what they need. Like "How many copies do you make in a week?" I don't think you'll find a whole lot of copier dealers who sell anything that's not needed. Usually, we're barely able to get an office to accept what they do need. They usually end up with something cheaper and end up paying for it later when their machine is down because it's over-used. We never sell them something that we think would send the company into bankruptcy.

Hey manipulating is one thing...but you would try to push a bum into buying a $60 meal when you knew it would keep him from eating for another week.

Admit it Eric...

You're "dirty" too.

Eric,
You're a sinner dammit!

Admit it and ask for redemption or face the wrath of eternal damnation in the pits of a firey hell!

Actually Eric, I like the fact that you are standing your ground and have some sense of morality.

Michael, do you believe that a copywriter can actually have these traits and still write decent copy?

Sure they can be a very good copywriter. No reason why they can't. I think some folks put out of their minds what they are really doing as copywriters-- manipulating.

I don't for one second try to fool myself into thinking I'm not manipulating. But I do take issue when someone manipulates another person into something that's harmful. And I really do believe that's what the mortgage industry did.

And yes, of course I'm a dirty sinner. But as of yet, I'm still in the closet.

Michael, you've been writing copy a lot longer than I, so take this as my point of view and with total respect to your opinion, but here's how I see it...

To me, manipulation is more of a negative spin on what copywriters actually do when they write copy.

Manipulation is more along the lines of using devious influence to obtain some sort of advantage.

This is not a true statement when it comes to all copywriter's purposes.

Instead, I believe, "persuasion", would be a more appropriate word for what they do, wouldn't you say?

When one persuades another, they are really just influencing the way they think. Showing their point of view. It is up to the person receiving this information whether they accept or reject these points of view.

We do this everyday, whether writing copy, trying to teach our children right from wrong, or trying to convince a merchant to lower their price... you name it.

Heck, even posts on this board can be construed as forms of "persuasion". People post their opinions and it is up to the reader to accept or reject. Whether they do accept or not has a lot to do with their world view, their prior beliefs, their own way of deciphering logic.

So, in my opinion, persuasion is probably the correct word to use, not manipulation.

So what do you think, have I just persuaded you in to seeing it my way or have I just manipulated you? ...you decide!