Hi All,

Just afew days ago I made a post about a character who had
intentionally tried to clone my website and "steal" my business.
I thoguht after hearing from this mysterious figure that it was
over BUT I'm a little naive at times.

He posted to this board saying that he will change the website
but he hasn't done so. I spent years and countless hours
to build my reputation as a copywriter. For someone to:

** Register a domain name like: http://www.ray-edwards-copywriting.com
is an OBVIOUS attempt to fool people looking for me.

** Use the same tiles "Author, Copywriter, Marketing Consultant"

** USe "my" tagline "the gets results copywriter" in title of the website.

** Use my copy flow almost wholesale.

**Use my SAME prices at the time the website was copied.

**Use the same background color and layout at the time the
website was copied. (I've since changed mine to black.)

I asked for my first post here about the issue to be deleted. BUT
the thread I made at the Blake forum AND the netbreaktroughs
board had mysteriously disappeared.

I have my strong suspicions about who is behind this. I've fired
them as a clinet and refunded their $5,000 deposit so I don't
see why they should try to mess with my business.

Thie is really disturbing to say the least ... I don't know who this
could happen to next.

It would be like me registering a domain name:
http://www.gary-halbert-copywriting.com

I'll seek legal recourse but sometimes community pressure can
be a swifter judgment ... if the posts are not deleted.

Regards,

Ray L. Edwards,
"the gets results copywriter!"

That's just terrible!!! I can't believe someone would have the nerve to do that.

People suck sometimes.

Ray,

I saw the guys site a few days ago and thought...hmmm..theres another Ray Edwards copywriter? Hes only damaging his image...cyber squatter, stealer, vampire..whatever he is, hes too cowardly to put his own name out.

Did I mention I know some really good hackers?

Hi Susan and Sammer,

I just googled "ray edwards copywriter" and it seems that this
guy has posted to every copywriting forum there is including
OUR Peter Stone's blog and Bob Bly's blog among others.

If he has been doing copywriting for 20 years as he claims where
is his portfolio? Where are the customer testimonials?

It's intended to just steal clients aways from me who would be
searching for me in the SE.

How sick can some people really get?

But I've learned an important lesson in my short lifetime: Nothing
can be done against the truth but for the truth. The more you try to
promote a LIE the more popular it makes the TRUTH!!

Still Standing,

Ray L. Edwards,
"the gets results copywriter!"

Well to shut him down, everybody aware of this should e-mail directly and tell him in no uncertain terms that what hes doing is despicable. As copywriters, we should tell him if youve been a copywriter for 20 years, you wouldnt have to steal somebody elses hard work.

Heck, Im going to email him now.

Couldnt care less if I burn this bridge!

I read your complaint. I'd be p*ssed as h*ll. On the other hand, getting that upset won't stop it.

I believe you can email Google, Yahoo etc. and tell them your situation. After investigating, they should ban the guy's site AND him.

I'd be interested to hear how it's coming for you.

First of all, I know Ray... the other Ray. I don't know his intentions, but I believe it wasn't malicious. And Raydal, he did offer to change things -- but last I checked, that was a few days ago -- changing, rewriting, re-formatting takes a bit of time.

Before jumping the gun, I would email him, prodding him. Use diplomacy first. If that fails, then take action. I've spoken to Ray, and I believe he's a mature, fair person.

Again, I have no clue of his true intentions -- and I certainly feel for you, Raydal.

I'm not defending him, nor condoning what he's done, if true. All I'm saying is, take it step by step. Don't jump from the frying pan into the fire... yet. Give it (diplomacy) or him a chance first.

That's what I would do. Sometimes, emotions can make us jump to conclusions or become a tad irrational -- and with every right, too, as this would piss me off just as well. BUT, according to the other Ray's posts, and his willingness to cooperate, I would give him the benefit of the doubt.

Don't judge too fast. That's all. Be swift and decisive, yes. But be diplomatic, too. That's how I would do things.

Take it as you wish. I would hate to see two copywriters squabbling when it may have been a simple misunderstanding or lack of judgement. We all make errors. We're all emotional. (Heck, we're copywriters for goodness sakes! Let's use our emotions and writing skills to our advantage.)

My commonsensical 2 cents worth.

The only plausible explanation of course is if his name is also Ray Edwards. If not, then I really feel its very malicious. Unless your name is Ray Edwards I really dont see any valid reason why you would buy that domain. Its like me buying:

www.michel-fortin-copywriting.com and claiming no harm.

Keep us updated, Ray.

Sammer, his name IS Ray Edwards, too.

All the points Raydal mentioned are plausibly coincidental. Formatting is easily copied -- especially those of my students or people who swipe "famous" copy I created (I see John Reese's style on many sites now). And titles are general, not copyrightable. Prices, copy flow and everything else is also not exclusive. What happens if a namesake DOES have the same prices? It can happen.

Everything can be either coincidental and/or easily copyable, without recourse. The only stickler from Raydal's list is the tagline. Now, that's where I would find it a little too strange.

But again, that's my observation -- not fact. And, Raydal's post makes sense, not because of any one similarity but, when all combined, it does make things look suspect. It when you add up all the coincidences that makes it hard to digest for Raydal, for which he has every right to be pissed.

However, and again, diplomacy prevails. It may simply be a lack of communication, or an error in judgment, or, as strange as it may sound, a pure, unvoluntary coincidence.

Doubtful, true. But we all deserve the benefit of the doubt, and we all deserve some time to explain/rectify/fix/make good. Once reasonable time has past, then it's time to cock the guns.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Let's start with this:

Thank you Michel for your words of reason. They do you credit.

Next:

I have stolen nothing.

I am shocked and dismayed at the nasty tone some of the accusations about this have taken. I have not said one disparaging thing about anyone who has posted about this issue - nor will I.

However, some very damaging statements have been made about me that are simply untrue. I am at a loss to understand why, and I would like it to stop immediately.

Read my copy. It is not - not any of it - lifted or stolen from the "other" Ray Edwards. Anyone who reads it will see that this is so. It isn't hard to do, folks. Just read it for yourself.

Is the tone and structure of the letter similar? Well, aren't most good sales letters similar? Don't they all have headlines? Don't they all have subheads? Don't they all have guarantees, offers, and PS lines?

Raydal, I have indeed made changes to my site, out of an attempt to be gentlemanly and accomodating to a fellow writer (who shares my name). I did not do so to remove any "stolen" material, as there was no "stolen" material to begin with.

I posted my picture on the site. We're very different looking. I thought perhaps that would help.

Since I don't plan to stop writing copy, and I don't plan to change my name... I'm not sure what else you would like me to do. But I'm willing to talk about it.

FYI, I began my career in the radio business in 1979. I have been writing copy - first for radio, and then through my connections in that business for TV, direct mail, etc - ever since. Just because you have not heard of me does not mean I don't exist.

I have called you and left a voicemail message for you; I hope you will return my call, so that we can discuss this one-to-one. I will work with you in any reasonable way so that we can both put this behind us.